Well, Nintendo tried to fight back with software updates and failed. Sony tries to accuse Team fail0verflow and geohot at the court in California.
More at:
http://git.fail0verflow.com/
http://geohot.com/
May Sony lose! And learn: Homebrew for all consoles should be allowed. I know a new OtherOS solution would make a software such as Gecko OS or such impossible - and also piracy.. but those guys wanted homebrew.. side effect is piracy.
They won't win that case here in California. We are too liberal. I might have to look into this case more, but I highly doubt Sony will win.
While I'm all for being able to do what I want to my own hardware...I will admit that something bothers me about distributing other people's private cryptography keys. I know I wouldn't want my private key being published on the 'net.
Well, true.. the private key leak.. I must admit, that came unexpected. However, well.. failing to use your signature code would result in that with all keys I assume.. I also have a private key which I use to sign and encrypt some e-mails (most of the time I do not use it) however, my keys are OpenSSL generated so they are kinda known to be safe.
Biggest issue for Sony is: the keys are burnt into the console.. while the SSL system webpages for example use allows a key revoke.. if a private key is leaked the CA could withdraw the certificate and browsers doing a regular verification would notice. Unfortunately, for Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft this isn't possible.. bad for Sony in the end that their key was indeed cracked.
However, as I said: I wonder why they do not use public implementations of ESCDA or RSA.. they are easy to be found and many of them are BSD licensed so they could use them.
at least nintendo didn't so something as stupid as sony did. after the first successful jailbreak was released sony threw out a horrible glitchy update that crashed ps3s that didn't use the jail break and froze there systems and then they expected those people to then send in the ps3 along with around $150 to fix it. sony in my book is now the worst company for that i learned never update : P just like wii
Quote from: Link on January 12, 2011, 06:48:48 PM
Well, true.. the private key leak.. I must admit, that came unexpected. However, well.. failing to use your signature code would result in that with all keys I assume.. I also have a private key which I use to sign and encrypt some e-mails (most of the time I do not use it) however, my keys are OpenSSL generated so they are kinda known to be safe.
Biggest issue for Sony is: the keys are burnt into the console.. while the SSL system webpages for example use allows a key revoke.. if a private key is leaked the CA could withdraw the certificate and browsers doing a regular verification would notice. Unfortunately, for Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft this isn't possible.. bad for Sony in the end that their key was indeed cracked.
However, as I said: I wonder why they do not use public implementations of ESCDA or RSA.. they are easy to be found and many of them are BSD licensed so they could use them.
The key that f0f got wasn't inside the hardware. It was factored out of the ecdsa algo based on duplicate r
edit by James: Your reply was inside of the quote, fixed it
I will be extremely pleased if Sony looses.
The gray area seems pretty unfortunate though......
*fingers crossed*
Quote from: Codyk on January 12, 2011, 07:27:24 PM
at least nintendo didn't so something as stupid as sony did. after the first successful jailbreak was released sony threw out a horrible glitchy update that crashed ps3s that didn't use the jail break and froze there systems and then they expected those people to then send in the ps3 along with around $150 to fix it. sony in my book is now the worst company for that i learned never update : P just like wii
lol nintendo did do this :P when they updated Boot2 :P Alot of wiis went back to them :P
But in the end it should make things intresting .. a few of us have already started to make Patch codes for the Games Elfs :) (Eboot.. Example FF13 money code)
its fun being able to do stuff like this .. :) My Next thing will be trying to find ways to get into the game saves :)
Well, I'll need to bump my own topic.. but I guess, Sony consoles are literally dead for me.. it's not that Sony are bad losers.. raiding people's houses who are absolutely not involved in piracy and all of that. It's a sad fact they are going that far, it's also a sad result that homebrew talk about the PS3 must be done on an extremely careful position here.
So how are our 3 companies ranking in the homebrew fight:
-Nintendo: no global consequences (global WiFi ban or such), just laughable attempts to block it with every update
-Microsoft: global consequences (full permament Xbox Live ban), strong attempts to block it, updates sometimes even released just to patch flaws (JTAG flaw, King Kong hack)
-Sony: PSN bans, strong attempts to block it - however unlike Microsoft such strong hacks have been leaked that it's literally impossible to get it completely fixed ever on current hardware, and suing homebrew developers
Last point in my opinion literally goes too far.. I have understanding for Microsoft.. also for game developers on the Nintendo side doing similar things (too bad no global solution seems to be possible on the Wii).. but Sony? Sorry, can't they punish players enough by just locking them out of PSN.. they literally lose a high amount of gameplay experience just by that move! Same for the X360.. why am I not on XBL currently.. because my legit box broke and my JTAG box cannot access it which is fine! Honestly, I think Nintendo is losing quite a bit of trust if I were a developer on how weakly they tackle piracy loaders.
Your opinions please. How would you rate Nintendo's, Microsoft's and Sony's behaviour!
Nintendo´s behaviour is too weak.
They let ppl. do what the want. After the unban methods were found, they even stoped banning hackers!
Using piracy loaders, hacking online... no counterattack from them, not even deleting (obvious) hacked score on rankings.
Didn´t they ever learn from their games being hacked over and over again? All the years and consoles, cheating was always possible!
I can´t tell much about Sony and Microsoft, but they are doing the right thing to stop the hackers. Sony is hesitated and took it a bit to far with storming into houses from PS3 hackers and conficating their computers/harddrives!
In times of the internet, it´s not possible to stop the data transfer if someone uploaded it to the internet. Anybody will always share it over and over again. Fail Sony, bad losers indeed.
Nintendo should have done more to protect online games..
Microsoft is 'perfect' with homebrewers, IMO.
Sony's actions are disgusting. I seriously hope they don't get away with it. Further, I hope they are stopped from continuing with their rampage against homebrewers who have broken no laws.
Karma!
http://www.joystiq.com/2011/02/28/ps3-shipments-blocked-in-europe-as-lg-wins-preliminary-injunctio/
http://www.joystiq.com/2011/04/11/sony-and-playstation-3-jailbreaker-george-hotz-settle-out-of-cou/
Settled.. I /really/ want to know what the terms were...
Quote from: James0x57 on April 11, 2011, 05:12:40 PM
Settled.. I /really/ want to know what the terms were...
http://psx-scene.com/forums/f6/settlement-george-hotz-case-84881/
there should be a pdf attached to that thread detailing the settlement
Sony looks for everyones IP address who vistited PS3-Hacks sites. The first person "Graf Chocolo" have to pay 1.Million € to sony for releasing Linux for PS3. Bad thing they do : /
So be carefull....
You guys should read this:
http://psgroove.com/content.php?979-Anonymous-Plans-Sony-Boycott-on-April-16
omg, according to that psx-scene link that thomas provided, Bushing and Segher were also sued by Sony!
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-WU1zd4CPT4Q/TWBKrBauwYI/AAAAAAAAAeQ/TCnKRY47vFc/s1600/boycottsony.png
I'm participating for the rest of my life.
I haven't bought Sony since the rootkit.
I haven't bought since PS2 - but I got that from a pawn shop..
Oh, wait, I did get a Sony Erickson phone for a 1 week about 5 years ago. Took it back though because AT&T is terrible.
...that explains why my Sony Ericsson is such a piece of crap...
Unfortunately, I actually loved the phone itself because of the full interface skinning ability.. Service was the deal breaker.
The phone crapped out on me twice in the same week just before its warranty was going to expire.
I had to go back to fido twice and they had to ship it back to Sony twice so they could repair it and 'update' its software.
When I got it back the second time I had to remember how to hack the phone again so I could do custom ringtones and backgrounds again.
I think Sony did whats right... I can guess that most 'Hackers' on PS3 have online (which is kinda what its for; the games are boring else). To have more hackers online though... Perhaps Sony made a few mistakes (i dont know if this has been confirmed yet but a large quantity of personal data was unencrypted, and there software wasnt 'up to standards'), but whether or not the results of the hackers actions was there goal, what they have done is illegal, so i back Sony up all the way. Just hopefully this next update will protect the network from further attacks...
Quote from: doomkaiber001 on April 30, 2011, 07:02:46 AM
I think Sony did whats right... I can guess that most 'Hackers' on PS3 have online (which is kinda what its for; the games are boring else). To have more hackers online though... Perhaps Sony made a few mistakes (i dont know if this has been confirmed yet but a large quantity of personal data was unencrypted, and there software wasnt 'up to standards'), but whether or not the results of the hackers actions was there goal, what they have done is illegal, so i back Sony up all the way. Just hopefully this next update will protect the network from further attacks...
Umm, the PS3 hackers e.g. GeoHot, Bushing, Segher did nothing illegal, at least under U.S. law. Reverse-engineering to develop interoperable software is considered a Fair Use right. European laws are generally even more liberal.
If you were referring to
crackers, not hackers, I think you're in the wrong thread....
Quote from: biolizard89 on April 30, 2011, 07:19:14 PM
Quote from: doomkaiber001 on April 30, 2011, 07:02:46 AM
I think Sony did whats right... I can guess that most 'Hackers' on PS3 have online (which is kinda what its for; the games are boring else). To have more hackers online though... Perhaps Sony made a few mistakes (i dont know if this has been confirmed yet but a large quantity of personal data was unencrypted, and there software wasnt 'up to standards'), but whether or not the results of the hackers actions was there goal, what they have done is illegal, so i back Sony up all the way. Just hopefully this next update will protect the network from further attacks...
Umm, the PS3 hackers e.g. GeoHot, Bushing, Segher did nothing illegal, at least under U.S. law. Reverse-engineering to develop interoperable software is considered a Fair Use right. European laws are generally even more liberal.
If you were referring to crackers, not hackers, I think you're in the wrong thread....
He's completely right.. Reverse-engineering is fine by European law too - it's admittedly difficult in case of the PS3 to develop software there are no real homebrew SDKs most "homebrew" uses the Playstation SDK - and the use of that is.. well.. probably illegal, I am not a lawyer. Cracking into systems howver and even worse
stealing data is certainly illegal.
And on an honest side: I did have a bit of Schadenfreude (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schadenfreude) about what happened to Sony but I also feel with all PSN users who lock their credit cards now. It is a disaster and well.. while Sony does treat hackers such as Geohot not in the way they deserve, we should still feel for PSN users who are afraid their data is being abused.
Technically, it wasn't stolen. Sony still has the data. This is the same argument we use with music; downloading music isn't stealing, it's infringement, because the original owner still has the data.
Sony has suffered from "personal data infringement." haha
I swear I didn't infringe anything! There was some sparks and then the bits just happened to resemble all this data!
Quote from: dcx2 on April 30, 2011, 11:18:55 PM
Technically, it wasn't stolen. Sony still has the data. This is the same argument we use with music; downloading music isn't stealing, it's infringement, because the original owner still has the data.
Sony has suffered from "personal data infringement." haha
so if the data is encrypted with something like TrueCrypt, then is it the same data as it was before? Or does that just make it something new?